In Search of Catholic School Excellence

 **Transcript is generated automatically. Please excuse any errors.

Hey folks, welcome back to another episode of the Your Favorite Catholic School Ideas podcast. I'm joined again by my co-host, Becky Wong. Hi, everyone. How's it going, Becky? Hey, good. How are you? Super duper, as always. Always fun to, to talk cool ideas and fun things that every school should be doing.

What do we have today? Today is no different. Today, we are talking about adding additional activities and programs, and what we mean by that is you have your kind of core, your core set of subjects and activities that the school runs. You might participate in sports. You have an art program.

You've got a handful of things. But when you look at your full population, you realize that there's so many more ways that you would love to work and support your community, your families. And you see kids with certain interests, and you're like, "Wow these kids would really take off if we had this kind of program."

But it's so hard. In this last couple weeks talking with schools who are... I think in the Bay Area, we're, s- we're having a issue of, and maybe a nationwide issue of enrollment. And so you're talking about, well, we're gonna have less kids, but we're trying to offer a great program, and then we're trying to offer a better program so that we can get those kids back, and it just becomes hard.

So today, we're gonna talk about strategies of how to add programs without necessarily adding more to the budget or how to be a little bit savvy about it so you can add more things without necessarily taxing your families or your community any more than you already are. So, let's take it away. So we think about this.

We're trying to add a few more activities, potentially the- it might be the arts, it might be different sports that kids could be into, different kind of clubs that you can add, maybe even different subjects that you wouldn't be able to offer during the day. Maybe you've you've got a foreign language and you're gonna add another one.

But we wanna do this without creating a ton of extra bodies in the building. Burden. Yeah. Work, cost, just- Yeah, work, cost, burden. How many different ways can we offer the meaningful programs to students without increasing that tuition overhead? So Becky, start us off. What do you see? Well, it's really important for each school to set themselves apart.

In a previous podcast, we talked about what makes your school unique, and this is a perfect topic or a perfect area to create that community, create the difference and that uniqueness of your school. And the best part is that you're creating, like, enrichment opportunities for your students, not just to add a random program, but when you look at your student population, you're saying, "Oh what are some talents that our students have, and how do we support them?"

I know when it comes to standardized testing and just any review that teachers have to do a summary or write-up, it's always like, how do we support our learners- Mm-hmm ... and high achievers? So we always think about that. And a lot of times it's oh we give them more work, or we change- Yeah

the type of work, right? And I always think are we punishing our, like, high-achieving students by giving them- Right ... more work? But this is a perfect opportunity of creating a program for your students who might not just be interested in sports. And during school tours, a lot of time parents are like, "Oh my kid doesn't...

They joined basketball and softball," whatever, but they didn't like it. Something that the school can offer them. And a lot of times, parents are so happy to hear there's other things like some sort of drama club, some sort of Little Lego League, other things, and that gets families really excited.

Yeah, especially if you think about going back to that episode, a parent pretty much just wants to drop their kid off at 7:00 in the morning- and almost pick them up at 7:00 at night, right? I gotta go to work. I can't deal with all this. What can you do for me?" And what happens between those times is, for the most part pretty similar across the board, right?

Everybody thinks their program is the number one program in the world, but it boils down to you have a lot of the same stuff between the school bells, right? Mm-hmm. What you do before that an early morning kind of a program where you receive the kids early, maybe even provide breakfast or whatever, something like that, or what you can do after school, and what you can do to support those kids that you're talking about that may not fit into the main three sports that CYO is offering, then that's where you can kind of make it yourself stick out a little bit.

Obviously, you're trying to do everything you can to be unique and awesome in the classroom, but sometimes adding those special classes or adding those special activities makes all the difference. And so that's kind of what we're here for, right? Figuring out how we can do a little bit more, meet those kids.

'Cause you can see when a kid is not participating or doesn't participate in anything, you can see that kind of drift away, and it's we gotta bring our sheep back, right? We gotta bring them back into the fold, and that makes parents happy, and knowing that you're actually paying attention to what the kids' needs are.

And sometimes that can be as simple as, "Hey, let's do a study hall after school," right? And maybe teachers- Oh, right ... they might just pick a day. Mm-hmm. Maybe you've got two days a month where you gotta run study hall, and that's a little extra homework support where the parent- doesn't have to know the math, that's coming home or whatever, and the, the teacher can help out It could be that simple, but it could also be as big as let's have a full-on STEM course where we're building things literally, not just no offense to the wonderful Lego groups that we all participate in, but- Mm-hmm ... Where the, the let's get some hammers and nails and some-

chainsaws. No, no chainsaws. But let's build something cool. And so at various different schools, we've seen this kind of come alive. Mm-hmm. Whether that be during the school day or after school, and so that's what we want to figure out, how we can do that. Sometimes it's just more time.

I guess the levers we're playing with are, do you have more time? Do you have more talents, or do you have more money? And I think if you have those three things, you already have space, right? Schools are left pretty much so many rooms unused- Mm-hmm ... with the electricity on all the time anyway. How can you take advantage of your space, but also that the extra time, talent, or resources?

Oh, yeah, and even back when I was teaching, we ended at 3:00, but our Chinese school that's separate from us, but the Chinese school, it's different set of teachers would come in at 4:00. So parents are like, "What do we do between 3:00 and 4:00? We don't wanna come pick up our kids and drop them off." So we did have after-school study hall that we're teacher-led.

It's voluntary, and we got a stipend for it, so Monday through Thursday, I would stay an additional 3:00 to 3:45 and make some money on top of that. And kids would be able to finish their homework, get some homework support. And how great is it when from a parent perspective, when I pick up my child, their homework is done, or a majority of it is done.

Exactly. And then you can just enjoy your time together, have dinner watch TV even. Yeah. Read a book. Yeah. That's so valuable. And I think you, you bring up a great point. It's we don't wanna necessarily tax our teachers any more, but- Mm-hmm ... there are opportunities or even small things that they may volunteer for.

I know that I ran study hall because I was a math teacher who saw kids needed more help. So- Mm-hmm ... let me get them for two more hours after school, where they're voluntarily showing up to- Right ... work on their math with me, or whatever else. I mean they could do whatever they wanted in study hall in terms of their homework.

I didn't get necessarily paid for it, but for me, it was like, this is worth my investment in order to get that done. Now, you can't necessarily force your teachers to work two more hours a day. Right. But there may be something, much like we talked about in the STEM classes at your old school- Mm-hmm ... where they're doing the thing that they love so much, they love it so much, that they are overjoyed to do it.

And that could be cooking. It could be music. It could be entrepreneurship. It could be photography. Whatever it is, the- they could run that thing after school, once a week- Mm-hmm ... twice a month, whatever it might be. That just adds a little bit more flavor, and especially if people are sharing that love.

It's just one more thing that folks have a, an opportunity to do, and I think that really enriches your program. That's like you. You're musically talented. You teach kids guitar once a week. Yeah, and back when I had my own classroom, we had two drum sets set up, and we had a bunch of guitars, and so I'd teach the kids how to play drums, and we had a whole music class.

We'd have writing music groups, and so those kids would then write original music and perform it for the school, or we'd play at mass. I mean, there's so many different ways that you can leverage those other things, and I think I've told this story 1,000 times- ... but I love playing music, so as a teacher, I was like, "How do I play music every day?"

And so as I was teaching religion, it was like, "We're gonna sing the song of the day that matches the gospel," or, "We're gonna sing the songs for mass this week." finding ways to do the things you love that fit into the curriculum. It's not just I love cooking, so we're gonna throw out math class in order for us to do cooking."

No. This all has to bend into the program. But you get so much more out of that, right? And it's I enjoy it, so if I'm having the time of my life and the kids are learning, like they're gonna have the time of their life. Like you just, you can't lose in that proposition. Yeah. And I think the bottom line is the, like how do we create more programs or opportunities for our students without costing the school a ton of money or resources?

And sometimes we don't have the human resources or the people to help us. What are some other things we can do? Where else can we look? Because sometimes it's like, "Oh, no, not another thing." Right. Right. And I think that goes back to mindset. I'm rereading Mindset by Carol Dweck- Right now, so like bringing up the mindset.

Normally, it's kind of like this feels like extra work. It feels like we're gonna require a lot more money. We're gonna need m- more stuff. You know- Right ... especially if you're trying to run a Lego program, you gotta buy stuff. But there, if you can change your mindset and think about, well, how can we leverage either that teacher enjoyment, community partnerships, folks that are already a part of our community itself, parents who might have the free time to share the thing that they love.

How can we use our schedule, our space, and be a little bit more flexible in how we're approaching all that? I think that mindset opens up a whole lot more doors, and you don't necessarily need to own every program as if it was something you created from scratch. You invented the wheel. You got the perfect shape of it.

You did all these- Mm-hmm ... wonderful things. It's the most beautiful thing you've ever seen. No. You don't have to start from scratch. You can partner with somebody else who's already got that going or take a very low-hanging fruit and turn it into a fruit salad, huh? Mm-hmm. You can enable these programs to happen.

So starting with that mindset, we can think out, a little bit outside the box. So obviously, you start with who's your talent, what were they willing to do? Mm-hmm. I love the idea of, I know at least one school who does the rotating study hall. So they've got 10 teachers in the building. That makes three days a month at most, right?

And in fact, you're probably getting only 20 days of actual school time in a month on average. Mm-hmm. So that means you're only doing two days a month of study hall. That seems reasonable to do that. And I know the principal, their approach was like, "Hey, at one point we had the luxury of 1,000 people here doing 1,000 things- Mm-hmm

and we could just compartmentalize. But we're getting down to the nitty-gritty. Our staff is getting smaller. We have less kids. We need to offer a little bit more. And so you can have that conversation, get people to sign up for two days. Whether that's part of the contract or not, you've got to figure that out for yourself.

But I think it's a reasonable thing to ask, especially when you normally ask them to come to these meetings on the weekends or at night. And if you're just asking, "Hey, two days a month can you just hang on for an extra hour?" I think that's huge. So let's step outside of that idea, 'cause as we talk about ideas, we'll we can talk about who's gonna do them.

Mm-hmm. Let's start thinking about how we can also take advantage of what's going on around us. We had an episode about who are the people in your neighborhood? Oh, right. Community engagement. Yeah, community engagement, right? And so thinking about a lot of these programs the classic one I always talk about is there's a local running club that meets every Saturday of the year, and sometimes they even do holidays, like it...

They'll do a Thanksgiving or a Christmas morning run. The location's published. It's a different location every week. You end up coming back to the same kind of, you know, four or five locations, but it's $5. You run the race. They track your time. It's very low-key you're not getting huge awards or anything like that.

There's not like the, the li- the huge stage at the end of it that's rocking out, right? But you've got you're in a race, costs five bucks per kid. They have a kids section, but let them run with the adults, and it happens every Saturday. There's your cross-country team for five bucks a kid, right?

You can even say We're gonna do this for 20 weeks. That's $100 a kid." You- That's a deal ... you could ask the families to pay that, and they probably would. Right. But you could probably also find somebody to do that. And I, this is probably a little bit early in the podcast, but I'm gonna give you the secret sauce.

Okay? Everybody, this is how you do this for everything. Okay. I used to be an assistant director at a Boys & Girls Club, and we were talking about programming. And it always came down to this, especially if we had a budget for programming. Mm-hmm. But you can do anything, right? A school year is 36 weeks.

The summer is 12 weeks. Mm-hmm. Okay? So depending where your program is Boys & Girls Club has, has to worry about both. Let's just talk school year for a second. So you got 36 weeks. Throw out four of those 'cause you're gonna be doing something wackadoo. It's gonna be Christmas, area time or- Right

or whatever. You have the after-school class parent-teacher conferences. So you got 32 weeks. Mm-hmm. Okay? What do you think it would cost to bring in an expert? Let's just say like they're amazing at what they do. 100 bucks an hour, that seems like a lot of money. Right. $50 an hour, that still seems like a lot of money.

But let's just play with $50 an hour for a minute. So $50 an hour, let's say they do two hours a week. Okay. Right? That's pretty much your after-school program, or maybe that's what you're running for the middle school. If you're running a program, that might be two, three hours. 100 bucks a week just to make the math easy, 32 weeks, $3,200 is what it costs to bring in an expert to run a class for the entire school year, right?

That's crazy. And then- I'm sure it's been more on paper. Yeah, exactly. The air conditioners in the classrooms from COVID The filters cost more than that per year. Yes. On top of that, let's say that class needs resources. Okay. Don't you think you could probably spend less than $1,800 in resources for that class for the entire year?

Oh, yeah, for sure. You could add any program to your school setting for $5,000 a year. Now you're like, "Where am I gonna find $5,000 a year?" Of course, you could charge people. Mm-hmm. The pizza lunch is gonna give you more than $5,000 a year. So like it's just, it's actually very simple math. It's super simple math.

You could have a bake sale, 'cause you're bringing your families to church on Sunday. The kids could out, be out there on a bake sale. We- Our robotics program is surviving because of this bake sale. Please buy us some goodies. The bake sale used to rake it in when I was a kid. After church, they would make 500 bucks per mass, right?

Wow. And they'd be like, they'd make four masses. We're in the wrong business. I know. We should just show up at churches- Just set up- ... and bake sales ... and lemonade. But it's so simple to do small things like that. And people don't realize that because it seems ah, it's so much more. And where do I find that person?

You don't necessarily have to go out, and it doesn't take much to dig. Mm-hmm. But leveraging who you have, who's around, and what they're able to do, you can do any program for $5,000 a year or less. Now granted, of course, you wanna go nuts. Buying the Lego robots is gonna cost you more than that. Oh, yeah.

The kits are like $400 each. Right. You gotta buy that, and maybe you gotta buy that every eight years. So if you amortize that- Mm-hmm ... it's not gonna be so bad. But think about the other times. I can think of, in robotics programs in s- in particular, my son's school, the robotics program is at every event selling cookies and sodas and whatever, like stuff they get at Costco, right?

Mm-hmm. Right. Well, like every event they have a booth set up, and Please support the robotics program." It's so simple. The kids are happy to be there. They're happy to le- you know, talking to people. Like it, it's just a win-win-win. The prices are reasonable. You're not getting gouged. I mean, I was at- And-

a place last night. I played, I paid $7 for LaCroix. I feel like I've committed- For one or a whole case? For one. For one. I feel like I've committed a sin of some sort. These kids are charging you a dollar, right? Which is still- Right ... A lot- Right ... but they're making some money off of it.

How many folks, we talked about this in the, I don't know if it was the community engagement or if it was just like fundraising ideas, but- you got sports on your site every weekend. Yeah. Right? Have a snack bar. Have a snack bar, and make sure that money ends up back in the school and not in somebody's pocket.

Yeah, no, quite a few schools I've seen where they do have games or whatnot, and the parents are running the, there's a sign-up after school snack bar. And I'm like, "Oh, they seem happy to do it." There's always, and there's like a parent lead that kind of just manages the schedule. Yeah. And if you're having lots of after-school programming, I know I got in trouble for this eventually, but it got people, the, the butts in the seats.

Study hall we had a snack bar. Oh, that's great. So instead of the kids walking up we were in the Excelsior District of San Francisco. Mm-hmm. Instead of walking up to Mission Street and getting involved in all the activities that were up on the, up on Mission Street, it was like- Right ... "Come to study hall, you can buy the junk here, sit here, do your homework, get stuff done."

Mm-hmm. "And you're safe, and you're gonna be safe until we close." Mm-hmm. Everyone would be gone by, let's say, 5 or 6 o'clock. Talk about taking care of those kids, getting them off the streets in a place that was a little bit more spicy than- ... the average school. But you can... There's a lot of money to be made there.

I know another place who does it, and the, the, it's not about making a ton of money as much as it is you're providing that service that kids need a snack after school- Mm-hmm ... and you're taking them out of the neighborhood where you don't want them n- necessarily roaming. But that's how you pay for these kinds of things.

It's so simple. It's really very simple. A lot of these things don't cost anything. We were talking about the running program. Girls on the Run. Mm-hmm. I know another school who did that. They just got some moms to volunteer after school once a week, and what they did was they were lucky enough to be across the street from a park.

They just went across the street and ran in circles in the park- Oh, yeah ... on the path. Come on. It can't get any easier. They had 30 girls on that team, right? And then they, I think they probably did a, a bigger event at some point. Mm-hmm. Once again, they go spend the $5. I'll donate the 150 bucks to send those 30 girls- Yeah

to run the race on Saturday, you know what I'm saying? It's so simple to do this, and- Right ... everybody's happy. The moms are happy. The kids are happy. And it's a nice opportunity for the girls to get to know other kids, get some fresh air, and that's when they have that time to chitchat, yeah. And build relationships and be friends, or make more friends. Yeah, for sure, and to get outside your own little, your little pod, right? Right. Kids that are older, kids that are younger. It's a great opportunity. So those are the kind of things that we're talking about. Minimal cost, real team experience, using what's available to you.

It doesn't have to be a big, heavy lift. It can be very simple. If we think about arts programs once again, going back to that 32 weeks, having... You can probably spend $25 a week, and actually I know of a, I know the Boys & Girls Club currently does this- Mm-hmm ... Based on our old plan. But you can spend $25 a week in materials, or less if you get stuff donated.

I actually still have boxes of markers and crayons from the time when I was teaching, which was a very long time ago. Me too. I can't get rid of my kids' crayons. Right. There just, there's so much you can do. That stuff lasts forever. You can do so much with that. So for less than $25 a week, you can supply an entire classroom worth of art materials to run an art class.

And- Mm-hmm ... I've got no artistic skill whatsoever. Mm-hmm. But we would do all kinds of folding art and box art and, of course, math art. Cause that's what, that was my role. We would do all those kinds of things where you can have a ton of fun building things or painting things or drawing things without having to worry about, do I have the best skill?

Am I gonna be compared to the other artists in the class? No. We're just having fun here. Right. This is for fun. Arts and crafts class. I mean, that was like, I feel like that was an '80s thing, arts and crafts. Get your lanyards out. Lanyards are cheap I know. I feel sad that the kids don't do those things back in the...

I was like, oh, at my summer program, it's just here's a bunch of felt. Cut it out and start sewing." So I came home with a ton of new toys just put some stuffing. I was like, "Oh." Yeah. It's super cool. Let's take it a step up. So we've talked about how there's a bunch of these kind of easy things.

Let's talk about more about the ideas. Mm-hmm ... so we talked about Legos, and obviously you can find a parent. I think in one school right now, they have- Mm-hmm ... three parents who have volunteered to run a STEM club after school. Yes. They can handle the Lego stuff. They crowdsource the cost of those Legos.

Mm-hmm. So that, that's one idea. I love the idea of the Technovation program, which I believe is still running. I think Verizon supports that. Oh, yeah ... and it's that one is meant for girls, but what I like to do, or Girls Who Code either of those programs, you can run the program simultaneously with the boys.

Whether you mix them or not, up to you, but use that curriculum- For sure ... with both groups. Even if the boys' projects can't go to some sort of national competition- Right ... you can enter them in 1,000 other things. But- Oh, yeah ... that curriculum- And it could be in-house or it could be part of your STEM showcase.

Yeah. Yeah, so many ways to celebrate those things. So Technovation with the parent team, that's a- Mm-hmm ... that's a really easy one. What are some other ideas that you've seen? Let's fill in the gaps of what could happen. Oh, yeah. So f- for sure I've seen at some schools they offer a language where parents in the community, they speak a different language, and they don't mind teaching a conversational Chinese, conversational French conversational Spanish that the school might not have offered during the day, or it could be a supplement to whatever they're learning today.

I know with the language program, we usually offer just the basic Spanish or just the introductory, but how about for the students who naturally or in their family they speak Spanish or they speak Chinese or whatever, so something even more advanced. Yeah, and if families are really into that and you can't find- Mm-hmm

a teacher, we had the episode with John Payne about how do you staff a class that you don't have talent for, and he used a company called Catholic Virtual for their particular need. Oh, yeah. But they can run an after-school class. You need a body in the room to facilitate- Mm-hmm ... but otherwise, the kids are fully engaged in a online class.

And if you're not doing online classes the rest of the time, having one online class where they're getting high-level instruction- Mm-hmm ... and that would be something I'm sure the parents would be willing to pay for. So y- that's a zero sum, a zero cost for the school. It's just a win-win.

So there's lots of ways to make that kind of thing happen. Or we talked earlier about music, right? Having a rock and roll club or- I hope one day we're gonna have little orchestras, right? School orchestras, so when you do the play, that the kids- Mm-hmm ... are playing the music.

Oh, right. Or even just a little band. You can just get enough kids who are good with maybe some faculty members to fill in the holes. You can have a good enough band that you could do at least a Christmas show or something, something less formal like an open house, if they mess up, it doesn't mess up anybody else's, yeah. It doesn't distract anyone. They're just playing in the background. How nice, yeah. We had the, a very first episode, we had the Sunrise Art Show from, with Abby Herget, and she always has a student, current student or former student, come and play piano.

And they play piano for the whole event. I mean, for it's like a three or four-hour event, and she just has kids rotating through so that there's always music. It's not singing. It's just- Oh, yeah ... just piano. And that's a great, that's another way to showcase what you're doing.

Mm-hmm. Lots of simple ways. The music program that I used to run which is s- still what I do after school. But we'd work with these kids and get them to play some songs, and then we'd have a, quote-unquote, "recital". And that recital was literally them playing their exercises or playing the song they learned, and it was, like, a half hour.

But the kids were built up for it. The parents were so excited for it. Right. And it cost us nothing. And the kids- Zero ... are so excited to just play that same, you know- Yeah ... could be a chord, could be something really simple. It's so great to give them those opportunities. I know at my old school, we had a few parents who didn't mind volunteering their time.

So one taught a cooking class after school. Mm-hmm. And they donated the registration fee to the school. Didn't have to, but... Or we didn't e- we don't have to charge, but we just charged a small amount to cover the materials for the week. Mm-hmm. And then they donate the rest. We had a lawyer who taught basic law and just what goes on in a trial.

They had a mock trial at the end. So it was like the, like you said, just find your talent, and sometimes it just takes an ask. Oh, hey, I know you're doing this," or, "It's your hobby. Would you mind volunteering?" And it doesn't have to be for the whole year. I think that's the one thing for me.

It's like, "This sounds great, but is this sustainable?" Or- Yeah ... is it we're gonna do it once and that's the end of it? And the kids know if it's just something like, "Hey, you're just doing it once. You get bored of it-" Then they're not vested, but if it's something where hey, it's a five-week program, 10-week program- Mm-hmm

just set your expectation and grow from there. Yeah. All of these things we're talking about, you're not adding to your staff. Oh, great. These things are all either volunteer, outside companies that you're partnering with, like taking advantage of the skills that they have so that you can build up your program.

You look great because you're offering it, but- Mm-hmm ... you don't actually have to be the expert. You don't have to know anything other than they're good at what they do, and they can supervise the children during that activity, and you're good. So yeah, I love that. You have the entrepreneurship classes.

I forget the name of the, the Junior Achievement. Is it called Junior Achievement? It is. Oh. Yeah. It's usually a company. I had a couple of young business people from the city or downtown. They'll come into my class during the school day, and they'll teach a lesson. They'll build a business. Yeah, that was kinda cool.

Yeah, it's fun. I mean we had T-shirt companies at one school where they were doing this Junior Achievement thing, and the kids were designing, and then at their s- parish festival, they had the two booths up, like who sold more T-shirts? Oh, nice. Like actual T-shirts. I think that's, it's such a cool thing to try that out.

Your baking club can sell their pies. Your whatever it is, you can get those things out there. I think it's pretty cool. You can do money lessons, like financial stuff. Mm-hmm. I know that kids will often think about they ... If they already ha- get an allowance, it's this is my right in the world.

But like, how do I- ... how do I generate money, and how do I protect that money? How do I grow that money? I think those are cool things that- And you can do those for just for a few weeks, right? Just like a little pilot- Oh, yeah ... program or maybe you do it once a month or whatever it might be. Mm-hmm.

But it can be very valuable, and you can really go-- I really push people to go outside the box. I mean, we've talked a lot about the things that seem natural. Mm-hmm. The obvious things. But when we talked about that one school who has their they call it their STEM class, but what it was is a problem-solving class where they would take real-life problems, and I've used- Oh, yeah

this example a thousand times, but if you were trying to-- in San Francisco, we've got a serious homeless problem. Mm-hmm. And a genius in the '60s who had lots of wacky ideas but he had this theory of lightweight and portable homes. And we're not talking about tents, people.

Oh, right. We're talking about real structures. But that he could-- he had figured out a way to build these things and turn them into backpack-accessible homes that you could build together with lightweight metals and things. Anyway, I digress. The cool thing about that is hey, what kind of structures could we build?

How would we design them so that it would be the least amount of materials so that we could do a lot of them we can get more people in homes, but then it would be, like, safe and secure? How could we do that? How would we address the bathroom problem, the shower problem? And have the kids wrestle with these real-world problems, which is another thing I love the Technovation because they're, they're-- in this case, they're using an app, but they're solving a real-world problem, and I think that would be great.

Critical thinking skills, like actually being able to build the thing whether that be digital or physical. Mm-hmm. Solving those problems. Maybe you have a service club Right? Oh, yeah. Let's go to the library. We're gonna tutor kids at the library. We're gonna go work at the soup kitchen.

Whatever it is. We're gonna go sweep the block. I mean, we did this as a class. Literally, we didn't never cross the street, but we got brooms and dustpans and bags, and we walked our block, and it just made it spotless. Oh, yeah. How nice is that? Even if it's gum or candy wrapper- Right

to be able to walk on just the sidewalk in front of your school and it's clean and you're not worried about stepping in things. And you'd be surprised how many kids would sign up to do that voluntarily. Mm-hmm. It's not you could force a group of kids to do that, of course, but there are...

There's definitely kids out there who are interested in helping others. Get them involved in the SF PCA, the the animal rescue. The little shelter. Yeah. Oh, yeah. There's so many different ways that kids would be so into that, right? We always laugh with my son.

It's like, "Do you wanna go hug a cow? Let's go hug a cow." you just wanna... You just... They love animals so much that they want to see them and interact- Mm-hmm ... with them the, the whole kind of like petting zoo. But taking that a step further, I knew a, a program where the kids were working at the zoo and, you know, volunteering as the docents But even like- Okay

even to go and do that informational thing, maybe you don't sign up for that. Mm-hmm. But to take that group of kids to go to the docent informational session, and to see and talk about that to be with the animals, like that's, like they would love that, right? So simple. I mean, you have to be close enough to a zoo or some other animal shelter or something like that.

But it's, again, a very easy thing to nurture. Maybe you got future vets in your classroom. I was about to say, what kid didn't decide their first career was being a vet? Like growing up. Right, or a marine biologist. Right. Right? Low tide. Figure out when low tide is and go to the tide pools.

Right. I mean these are small things that you can put together. But I mean, we're talking about leaving the campus. Maybe that may be not what people- Mm-hmm ... wanna do. But there's so many different ways to enrich your program that don't cost a whole lot. It might just require someone's time, right?

Mm-hmm. Might just require a little bit of planning. But for the most part, you can pull these things off relatively cheaply. And I, as a principal, I would be looking to fill in as many gaps as possible. Mm-hmm. I would want... You always have to worry about liability, of course. But assuming- Right

you're taking care of your kids from 7:00 to 6:00, let's say- Mm-hmm ... every day, or 7:30 to 6:30 or 5:30, whatever it is, that you've got something for every kind of, you know, interest in your world. Anything you can pull together and take the low-hanging fruit. You don't have to be everything to everyone, but you have to be something to your people, right?

You can't just be a place where they clock in and clock out. Oh, yeah. Yeah. It's not a babysitting service. Yeah. And be good at the one thing or the two things you're you're gonna offer as opposed to offering like 1,000 things and they're all terrible. Yeah. I would say that you can easily add one or two things per year- Mm-hmm

without flinching, and then you can do, you could probably do one a month of the one-off. Let's just do- Mm-hmm ... this one thing. We talked about the arts, but get into writing. What about a poetry club? Once again, doesn't have to be every week, doesn't have to be every month.

Mm-hmm. But even if you did a short stint or you do it a once-a-month type thing and let kids explore that realm cause you might find that they're little writers. Right? Science we always talk about STEM clubs. Mm-hmm. But what about taking those science concepts and taking them further, right?

So especially in a middle school if you're working on, you're getting ready for your science convention or whatever it is, and you're in that scientific method world- Mm-hmm ... where it's like, well, after school, during these times, of this time, we're gonna be playing with our things a little bit more, or we're- Right

we're going to be exploring these other topics a little bit more because it's exciting. Mm-hmm. Or maybe the, the different age levels, they all match up with a certain skill set that you can apply in a new way. Or right now we just had this we're kind of putting the episode in a certain time, but we just had astronauts go around the moon.

Oh, yeah. Why not take that interest and do a deep dive for a week, right? Or a couple weeks maybe a couple days in, in a couple weeks where you're talking about that. Right now, space and that whole world is front and center. In two weeks it might be gone. Right. So here's your opportunity to capture the kids' interest.

Oh, yeah, definitely take advantage of the current events and you kn- you don't know where it goes. And like you said, maybe just have that one event. If it gains traction, why not turn it to something that's weekly or something longer, and you never know. It piques someone's interest. And what I really like about everything you just said is that a lot of it's student-led, things that our students are interested in.

And I know from a teaching sp- perspective, it's like planning usually takes me the longest, like gathering the materials thinking of the ideas. But having it student-led, it's stuff they're interested in, and it's not what a parent volunteer is like, "Oh, this is cool. This is what I did back my day."

So the kids are like, "Hey what's the problem? How I would tackle it?" Things they're interested in right now, that's fantastic. And it makes it sustainable where you're like the kids aren't just showing up and Oh, what are we building today?" have them plan these things.

And it's like lifelong skills. Instead of things handed to them, it makes them think about it. I know with the age of AI, we're all concerned about, like, where's the critical thinking, will kids stop thinking? Will they stop reading? But these are opportunities where our kids are engaged, and it makes them want to think about it, ask questions, and execute.

Yeah, I mean, it's up to us to offer those opportunities. Mm-hmm. I think if in a general philosophy of how You know, create a culture in school. Let's just say a, a school now, I mean, I used to say 300 is a nice number. But let's just say you've got 200 kids, and you have them for nine years.

Most of what you do will rake in probably, I would say, in general, almost 90%. Your normal program- Mm-hmm ... will reach that 90%. There's probably gonna be a, a top five and a bottom five, and that, the, those things could be academic, but they could be social, it could be whatever. Mm-hmm. But there's gonna be these two other groups that are gonna need something else.

And at some point in those nine years, you have to hook every kid and bring them in. And I- Right ... As a teacher, you might do that in your classroom each year. But what's one thing I can do that gets me connected with this one kid? Mm-hmm. To do that for the 200 kids, it sounds like a lot, but it's really not, because you might have five or 10 kids that naturally love everything that you can possibly throw at them.

They're just into it. Right. And so you don't have to try very hard with them. But the next 10 kids, you're gonna have to try a little bit harder. Mm-hmm. And you might realize that oh music's the thing that kid connects on or is really interested in. How can I bring that kid into that, that piece?

Mm-hmm. And it doesn't have to be something you have to do every day, all day, all the time. But you have to make the concerted effort to bring all those kids in. I think that's what your program is. So it's not just randomly choosing things that don't relate. Right. It's all about, how do I bring these kids in, help them realize their potential- Mm-hmm

and raise them up to be awesome, confident kids who are thinking of others other than themselves, right? Oh, right. It really can be a game changer, and I think this is another one of those ways. I mean, all of the things that we talk about I think are game changers. Otherwise, we wouldn't talk about 'em.

But I think it's it's important that you address those kids. And like you said, you're probably gonna sweep a bunch of 'em through with just your average program. But you gotta make sure you touch every single kid and make sure that they're connected to this place. 'Cause if not, they're that kid's not connected to their classroom.

Mm-hmm. They're not connected to school, their family's not, and that's- Oh, right ... If nothing else, you have an enrollment issue if that kid is not involved. Yes. Not to mention a philosophical and spiritual issue. So making that the key, I think is what's great.

So now we've been talking about all this wonderful- ... rosy, happy things. Yes. What are some of the pitfalls that you think the naysayers are gonna throw at us when we th- we throw out these ideas? Well, one that always stands out to me is that we always have volunteer for Lego, and it's whatever grade level their child is in, and then the kid graduates, the program's dead.

Yeah. So we gotta make it sustainable in that we want to invite more. I know a lot of times we kind of look at the kindergarten parents and say, "Oh, we should get them involved," invite them to community. So that's always a way to like even though their child's in kindergarten, make a connection sooner than later.

At least you have a good nine years, right? Yeah, and you can formalize that process. Here's an eighth grade parent who's been running it. We have a kindergarten parent who will run it. Right. And then you just keep folding that over. Or have a mix lower grade, middle grades, upper grades.

Just invite everyone. I know in the past, or occasionally even with ru- running a school event, some sort of auction or fundraiser, I hear that some parents are like reluctant to volunteer because it's Oh, it's that same family," or, "It's this group," so they're like, "Oh, we don't wanna step on any toes."

But to create a culture where everyone's invited, it's not just the same people all the time. And- Yeah ... a lot of time we're like, "Oh yeah they'll take care of it. We don't need a volunteer." So just make sure everyone feels invited, and it's not just the same people all the time. It's the same thing in our classroom where we ask a question, it's the same kid raising their hand.

Right. Gotta mix it up. The other thing I would say, just consistency and quality. It's like, hey, the first year is always awesome. The, you don't want the next year. It's like a TV show. It's oh, the first season's always great. Yeah. Then the sophomore year it's oh, you gotta drop off an audience.

Just to create either a checklist or something at the beginning and the end of the program, not necessarily the year. Just say, "Hey what did we like about the program?" Or, "What would we like to see in the program?" And at the end, evaluate. I think a lot of times we don't ask for feedback. We're like, "Oh great, it's the last week of whatever."

It's over. See you later. Have a good summer. But we don't stop and evaluate like, oh, what was great about it, what would we like to have for our following year. And then what are the not so great? And I tell my real kids this all the time, it's yeah, it's hard to hear criticism, but that's like gold.

That's how you build your program. That's how you get better as a person. Yeah. So when people do tell you like, "Oh, yeah, I didn't really like this," that was, And kids will- they're like the most honest people ever. Yeah. They'll tell you when something is terrible or boring. So true. Yeah, and just making sure logistically having overlapping programs.

So you're like, "Wait, why isn't this program... It just has five kids, but we're expecting more." Just look around. A lot of times the school offices tell me like, "Oh yeah, it's basketball season." Or a parent would be so nice, they'll email me back and say, "Oh, I'm sorry, we want to sign up, but they have whatever practice after school."

So just like scheduling, taking a look at that and don't be personally offended if no one signs up for your class. Yeah. Yeah. And- And I think from the office standpoint you have all these programs that you're running and to not necessarily schedule them all in the same place, right? So you just kind of think oh yeah, you can always use that classroom, and then there's five programs trying to use that classroom on the same day.

Oh, right. Yeah, I would say that's the first place to check. Talk to the people in the office talk to the teachers, especially if we're using their classrooms. Oh, hey, is it okay we use your whiteboard or use your projector?" It's just like the little things. And lastly it's not a pitfall, but just make sure your volunteers pass background check or whatnot.

And that can be a barrier because sometimes that takes a long time and you- you're like, "Oh, our program's starting next week or two weeks from now or next month." But if your volunteers didn't go through all the hurdles, then that kind of stops your program from starting. Yeah. Yeah. So, so important to take care of that, those early logistics.

I love the idea. I mean, if your volunteer is going to be a parent- we, I've seen it a couple places where the kindergarten parents come in, they do it as part of kindergarten night. They all just get fingerprinted, and the test all done at that, like- Oh, yes ... one time. It's so smart 'cause then they're in the system forever, and then it's not really an issue assuming they all pass.

Oh, yes. I- I've had a few schools where everyone's required to do fingerprints and whatnot because the school might have parent drive for field trips. I know some schools like, "No, we don't want that." But you know, it's again, take a look at your culture, look at your community. What are some things we wanna have in place at the beginning of the school year so that it's not a barrier or hurdle later on?

Yeah. Yeah, so true. So then the flip side is what are some key advantages that aren't necessarily at the forefront here? Well, I would say just bringing in the community. That's a big one for me. It's like, it's almost invisible where a lot of times we're, like, talking about how do we increase enrollment, the whole thing about word of mouth, it's just hey, you have a community. They talk about your programs and just even if they say no, at least they know about you and know the needs of the school and what students are interested. It increases parent engagement, not just because we want parent volunteers, but parents talk to each other.

They're like, "Oh, hey," or even like a lot of families, their kids don't go to the same school, but they're like, "Oh yeah, my school has this program." What do you do when you work late nights?" What do your kids do?" instead of just typical just sports or whatnot, or it's just like after school program where they're just playing in the schoolyard.

They talk about their experiences. How about you? What are some other things that you think are like- Well, I really like what you're saying there 'cause we talk about kids and families being invested in the school. Mm-hmm. Right? And if they're invested in the school- Yeah ... then they, they give not just financially, but they give of themselves more.

But they're more likely to stick around, which is what we're worried about here. Mm-hmm. But you know if a kid has one connection, so let's just take the sports example you mentioned a second ago. They're at this school because they want to play on the sports team.

Mm-hmm. That's their only connection, right? Right. And then every day after school, they're gone because they're associated to 14 other things. Like, all of those other things might be wonderful, and of course you can't, once again, be everything to everybody. But if the kid only has one connection to the school, if that ever breaks or gets wonky- Mm-hmm

that, that kid and family are gone. So- Yeah ... as you generate more of these things that the kids and the families are starting to make more and more connections, right? They're touchpoints, right? You can almost draw a line, like their picture and the activity, right? So it's just like, how many lines can I draw-

to this kid and family that they are so invested in the school that, that they're the reason why. It's wonderful, and it's not so much that it they're giving of so much, but just that they are participating and loving the place so much that only lifts everything else up. So I would say that really taking advantage of low-hanging fruit and- trying to work the community as much as you can as opposed to just pulling in outside things. Those outside things might help you fill a gap, but those are, like, the last resort, right? As opposed to, like, how can I really engage everybody else in my community in building these things? I would say that one key thing to look at when you're successful, look at your alumni database, or just your alumnis.

Do they come back? When you build these programs, they're gonna wanna come back. And I know it's like playing the long game, and a lot of times we just look at this school year, next school year. But when they graduate, do they come back? Do they volunteer? I know a lot of times on the school tours, we love it when we say, "Hey, our teachers, they used to go to school here."

I know a few schools, the principals went to school there. And guess what? The families, they bring their kids back. When our kids grow up and they have families of their own, they're so happy or they're so proud to say, "Oh, I went to school here. My grandparents..." they do the pick-up and drop-off, and they talk about their experience, and that's how n- you know you're successful when you build these programs.

Not necessarily little programs, but these are, like, things that they remember, and you keep coming back. And again, we always say Oh, no, enrollment's dropping off," What's going on?" But if alumni are coming back, that's how you build your word of mouth. It's like, hey we have that population, yeah, the reputation. It's like a built-in feeder. Yeah, reputation. The reputation- That's how to build it ... the legacy the- Mm-hmm ... if people are talking about things. And once again, some things are gonna last. You're gonna try to keep them going for 10 years. Right. Which case alumni are gonna remember, and they're gonna come back for.

Some things can be spur of the moment. Mm-hmm. They can be tied to a current event, and may never repeat themselves. But the fact that you're making the effort to make those connections and bring new things into the school, people love that. People appreciate that you're trying. You gotta do everything well, so you might not do everything, but there's definitely the risk of saying "Oh, we can't do that right now, so we're gonna do that next year."

And, but- Yeah ... next year becomes 10 years very quickly. Right. And that family's gone in 10 years. If you're lucky, they were there for the entire 10 years, right? Yes. So y- you've gotta try to make some of those things, and they can be little small baby steps, but eventually baby steps become walking and running, right?

And then those things can just happen on their own. So you gotta start somewhere, and I really f- we really encourage people as we come to the end here, take at least the first step. Mm-hmm. Try a few things. See how it might work to investigate, because that investment in your program is only gonna benefit everybody and build the program forward.

So as we get to the end here, what do you think folks should do if they're thinking about something like this? Well, first check out what are the needs of your schools? You hit a lot of parent emails going, "Hey, are you gonna have this program? Are we gonna have Legos? Are we gonna have coding?

Are you gonna have guitar classes?" Just talking to people, find out what are people's interests. It's- Mm-hmm ... it's really nice to hear from parents because their child must have brought it up, right? Right. Check in with your parents, local businesses. Again, reach out. Who's part of your community?

Who are your shareholders? What are some things that they're happy to share with the school and students, yeah. What programs that- ... check out your teachers. Sometimes it's not just about teaching. Maybe they have other interests and they would love to, like you, share their musical talent.

It's just as a fun thing, it can't just- Yeah ... be all about work. Yeah. See what programs you can take advantage of that are already happening. Mm-hmm. Something's happening at the library, guess what? That's part of our world now. Oh, yeah. Something's being offered by a community center th- that's part of our world now, right?

I think just, once again, low-hanging fruit. As you said, look at what's going on around you. Look what you have. Mm-hmm. The art room is not being used 90% of the time. Well, let's use- Or if maker space, right? Right. You built that maker space. What's it being used for, right? Yeah, exactly.

Let's get making. Take advantage of your space, your assets, that your talent your places. What else? Well, not just looking at within your community. Look at the big organizations, like you said, Girls Who Code. I know my local library has a program. It fills up so fast. Then I'm like bummed because I didn't sign up in time because it's like literally one day it fills up.

Bring that program to your school. And a lot of those programs aren't very costly, so yeah, look at big organizations, too. Start with one or two programs. Make sure that just, it's feasible, it's practical, it's up and running before you decide you want to say, "Hey, let's just do 10," 'cause everybody... And it's nice to give people variety, but just make sure your one or two programs check with your other schedules sports and whatnot, and the school calendar.

Things we take for granted, like signup, make sure it's easy. Yeah. Sometimes we're like, I'll get emails like parents go, "We tried to sign up, but the link was broken," or whatever. Yeah. Oh, wait, that doesn't happen with us. But I've seen it. That's why they call us usually is- Yes ... to fix the front end To fix those things, right?

But make sure the process is easy. I would recommend digital forms, like Google Forms, just a quick first name, last name, grade. Make sure other things to check for, your volunteers. Make sure they understand the commitment. I know things happen in life, but then I've never run into this, but hopefully the parent does, or whoever the volunteer is doesn't go, "Oh yeah, I, this is boring.

I'm gonna stop." Can't do this anymore. Yeah. Right. Yeah. That's always a thing. You find the commitment. But- Yes ... once again if you're trying to be nimble or trying to be flexible and figure this out, you can start off with, "Hey, let's just do, are you willing to do two weeks?"

Yes. "Are you willing to do a month?" Right? Can we make it small? And then we can kind of decide if, how do we formalize this? Mm-hmm. And maybe that initial person's not the person who wants to formalize it. Mm-hmm. But you as the school have now vetted this process- Mm-hmm ... and this activity, and you're like, "People want this.

Now how do I find that outside person or that expert that I can bring in to formalize this, to make sure it's consistent?" And that's where partnering with somebody, a third party company that does this- Mm-hmm ... they're gonna show up because they're financially invested in it. Oh, yeah ... I still think that's typically a last resort, or when it's ready to blow up into the big thing, you'd actually hire somebody to do that for you.

But starting small and just little baby steps get a short commitment and see if it can work before you blow it up into the big thing. I think also the last kind of idea is you want to celebrate it well, you want to brand it well. So it's not just- Mm-hmm ... Maybe that initial program is like, "Hey, we're doing poetry- Poetry slam.

It's like a one little thing. Mm-hmm. But that already has an idea, like gives parents an idea of oh, they're gonna get together, they're gonna read poetry, they're gonna write poetry. Mm-hmm. I kinda get it. Some way to celebrate the thing, some way to market it in some special way.

So it can be a club, it can be a program, whatever- however you need to do it. Mm-hmm. It should be, it should feel like something special. Right. You can add heft to those things by increasing your audience or whatever else, finding ways to celebrate it. It makes it feel like something special.

And it gives kids the chance to see what it is and Oh, I'm actually interested in it." as opposed to go, "Nah, poo, it's poetry." Where they see it, they're like, "Oh, maybe I wanna do that." So it opens up a larger audience where, you know, whether there's misconception or not from the kids' perspective, they're- now they're like, "Oh yeah, I wanna do that, too." Yeah. We have to remember that kids don't know what they don't know. They have no idea. Most adults don't know what they wanna do either, for that matter. Yeah. So we just have to give give kids opportunities to try things out and see if they do like it.

And then- Mm-hmm ... Our job as the administrator is to recognize that a kid is interesting s- into something and help nurture that. Mm-hmm. All right. So as we wrap up, do you have any final thoughts? I would say key takeaway, don't be allergic to starting new programs because it costs money. Right It's really the intention itself.

Like you said, a lot of the things or programs, it could even be a club and not necessarily like a formal lesson every week. Start small. Could be free. It's just, you just need a moderator, just kids who love whatever the program is, and just get started. I know as we're coming up in the end of the school year and when this will finally get published, most folks would be like, " it's just too crazy to try something."

Right. But I think this is the time, actually, May, where everything... May is probably a great month to try things out because things are culminating, and there's actually a lot more space and freedom to do things because you're ending. Yeah. That people have more free time, sports is wrapping up, like all these things are kind of finishing.

You can try something and see if it, there's interest in it. And- Right ... I always like the idea of here's a preview of what's coming next year, right? I know. It gets the kids so excited to come back to school, yeah. As opposed to Oh, no, summer vacation's over. Oh, now I have to wake up early."

It's something to look forward to. And what's nice is that if it's some, it's a new program, and you start in May and you're like, "Oh, no, it's graduation," whatnot, guess what? You only have the four or five weeks where you're like committed to it. If it's successful, you continue, but if it's terrible, it stops.

It's in the natural ending to it. Yeah. Yeah. I would say the thing that I, the, the call to action I would throw out there is I would really push everyone at this point of the school year to think about what's the lowest hanging fruit, and then you think about talent, time, and space. Mm-hmm. What thing has the least amount of friction- Mm-hmm

that you could probably start in, in the... The exercise I like to think is like, "What could I do tomorrow," right? Like I don't have any, I don't have to go shopping. I don't have to do anything other than get people to show up. What could I do that would enhance our program tomorrow, right?

Right. We talk about the art room being available. The gym is not being used at this point in the season maybe. Mm-hmm. Whatever it is, what can I do? And those are the things that I'd start with. Mm-hmm. And just try something, a one-off now. Secondly, if that thing, and this is just an exercise in thinking, if that thing were to take off, what would I need?

Who would I need- Right ... to make that thing real? And if you can just put that thinking process together, those things will probably lead to action. But do something cool and new in this next month. Just do it once. Even if it's only once, it's a one-off. Right. Just do one cool new thing. Could be lunchtime, could be after school, could be a weekend thing if you have some sort of festival still going on at this point in the year.

Mm-hmm. But just try one thing this next month that you're kind of low-hanging fruit interested in. Oh, yeah, and it, the kids sometimes you feel like hopefully teachers aren't doing this, just showing movies to kill time on a Friday. But think of that one thing. Could even be a club on thinking about building clubs.

Sure. And I'd offer to everybody who's listening, feel free to follow links through the website here. Love to have a conversation with you. Free consultation. But, like how can you build a program for next to nothing? Mm-hmm ... I've had to do that 1,000 times over. You've had to do that so many times, too.

Love to have that conversation and help you realize something cool for your students. We'd be happy to help you plan that whole thing. It'd be a, a very ... It'd be a fun conversation and no cost to you. Oh, yeah. We love to talk about school stuff. Especially when it's dreaming. Yeah.

I'm a dreamer, so I wanna dream about that cool new program. Well I guess that's ... We're about to end here. A couple podcasts you can listen. What Makes You Different, we talk a lot about these things. We mentioned so many different podcasts today as links back to what you can listen to, and the Community Engagement.

Those two podcasts would probably make a lot of sense for thinking about how to come up with an idea for what you're trying to do. But look around you, see what's possible in your community and see what you can come up with. I thank you, Becky, as always. Fun conversation.

Oh, thank you. Always happy to chat about schools and how to make it better. Yeah. So hopefully next, next check out the show notes. We'll have a plan for how you can attack this for yourself, and hopefully you'll come up with something cool for your school. We'll see you all next time on the podcast.

Okay, bye. Bye.